I am calling you to come from the ends of the earth to pray to "shift the economy." What do I mean by "shifting the economy"? Last January, at Chuck Pierce's Starting the Year off Right conference, God gave a group of us a prophetic word that He was going to "shift the bull and the bear market to become a lion market" and then went on to say, "And I will have enough shares in this market."

For too long we have known to pray for our nations, but we have not known how to see to it that the Lion of Judah ran the economies of nations. He is the Creator, and believe me, He knows how to heal nations!

The Lord has shown me that He wants to release a "corporate Joseph anointing" into the Body of Christ in 2009 and 2010. If one looks at the history of the Stock Market Crash of 1929, although many suffered, there were those that gained great wealth because they knew what to do in difficult times. This is the manifestation of the Issachar anointing that we are crying out to God for during this time of shaking. God is going to show us what to do.

God Said, "Pray for the Stock Markets and Economic Systems"

Although the word I am going to give is a strong, dire one, think of it as a warning that is merciful. Judgment can be averted and a blessing left behind with economic systems changed in such a way that will eradicate systemic corruption - so that we can eradicate systemic poverty.

For the Lord says, "I am answering your prayers and have begun the cleansing of Wall Street; exposing the wickedness and greed in high places. Pray now and I will begin to give the leaders of the nation wisdom on how to revamp and reverse the debtor system currently in place. This is a course correction.

"If you do not pray at this time, you will miss your day of visitation and the economy will collapse, causing a ripple effect that will sweep the nations with a major tsunami wave. This wave will begin to touch the ground, as even the harvests of the world will be affected. Food shortages, hyper-inflation and other sorrows, especially affecting the poor, will take place.

"However, I say, if My people respond and fall on their face and cry out at this time with a mighty cry, I will hear them and heal their lands.

"Hear, O nations of the earth! Respond with weeping and travail and pray for the stock markets and economic systems. Pray for your leaders as well; for the earth is in the throes of a deep shaking at this moment; for the systems of the earth must be reformed.

"Do not despair and think that I cannot heal; that I will not hear your crying to Me from My throne in Heaven. My ear is carefully listening for your sound, so I will reverse the curse and bring a blessing upon your lands."

This is no time for business as usual! As per Joel 2, it is time for the Bridegroom to come out of the chamber and fight for the land.

BUT, I do agree that we should really be praying for our leaders and decision makers. The Lord has been speaking to us that this is a time of correction and we do have an opportunity as never before to see a GODLY change in our nation. My husband and I are praying without ceasing at this time.

My question is: Where are the true prophets? Where are the watchmen?

I have read posts on this forum that pertain to the present conditions some would contribute some wouldn't.

The Media at times would allude to economic disarray.
Again I ask wheres the discernment?

I guess as long as it doesn't hit at home, it's business as usual.
Were surrounded by all types of circumstances daily and yes it is our responsibility to discern what is what.

I recall a post that we should recognize that the sight realm for the most part is the lie realm. That being said there's half of your discernment.

I recall another post calling all to draw close to the Father.
That the Fathers longs to spend time with us and create a true relationship as of a one on one or being one with Him!!

I guess were all at fault on this one.
Either we ignored our surrounding circumstances.
Decided not to get involved, once the problem arose.
Have we become cold, lukewarm or will the present circumstances cause us to become HOT again on fire for the Father.

I say go before the Father, make it your priority, You have always been HIS!!!

OTHER...

I do NOT know what tomorrow holds, if the Lord wills,
we shall go into such and such a city, buy and sell
and get gain.

But this much I know: I know God is "shaking."

What all and why I do not exactly see but I have heard
POLITICS as well as RELIGION. It got my attention.

God will only do us good in the long run.

The second death is the the death of our Adam spiritual death state .... it is the dieing to our Adamic nature which is dead to the spirit.

All this works on both sides of the grave.

Maybe some others could help you to see this.

Elwin Roach, Preston Eby, Ray Prinzing and many others have written on this. Plug any of those names in with Lake of Fire into your search engine and hopefully you will see the truth of the matter.

Then you can join some of us in the Fire of His Love.

And they come to Jerusalem, and Jesus having gone into the temple, began to cast forth those selling and buying .......... Mrk 11:15

"God will only do us good in the long run."

Amen

This is a man that who had the fear of death and hades burned out of Him in the Lake of Fire. Such will be also the mindset of those that have learned to stand in God's threshing floor and purifying furnace. We must come to rest perfectly in God's will whether it be death or life.

""O DEATH, WHERE IS YOUR VICTORY? O DEATH, WHERE IS YOUR STING?"

1Cor 15:15

Here's where I am. Our country and leaders and the TPTB
(the powers that be) are making MAJOR, MAJOR changes in the next 24 hours. But folks are haggling over scriptures as to what/where hell is. Well it's about to arrive on the front lawn of the USA.

The AIG bailout of 85 Billion dollars just cost every man, woman and child $2000 annually. So come April 15th I hope everyone has that set back in their savings. Now the real deal is 700 Billion which more like will be trillions.
What is that going to cost. I can't even do the math on it because the average calculator on your desk and mine will not crunch the numbers. Our country without a doubt and in fact is moving moving not into socialism but complete and extreme facisim and communism. Study your history books or google it if you want to know what all of that means. But not one word in the bill calls for a minimum wage increase for the average american to be able to pay this outrageous tax.

But here's the deal. I don't see any 'Christian' groups marching on Washington or Wall STreet praying or praising
or blowing trumpets or whatever to bring down those walls.
I guess we all have the Doris Day attitude.

So what am I saying: I guess we better 'know our God and be able to do some exploits".

Bev

Let us be reminded of these scriptures in Romans,
Rom 8:31 What then shall we say to these things? If God is for us, who can be against us?
Rom 8:32 Truly He who did not spare His own Son, but delivered Him up for us all, how shall He not with Him also freely give us all things?
Rom 8:33 Who shall lay anything to the charge of God's elect? It is God who justifies.
Rom 8:34 Who is he condemning? It is Christ who has died, but rather also who is raised, who is also at the right hand of God, who also intercedes for us.
Rom 8:35 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
Rom 8:36 As it is written, "For Your sake we are killed all the day long. We are counted as sheep of slaughter."
Rom 8:37 But in all these things we more than conquer through Him who loved us.
Rom 8:38 For I am persuaded that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
Rom 8:39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Let us over take the darkness with the light that we are,
for the light that we have is our true sight.

Blessings to All.
OTHER...

Amen!

If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

2 Chronicles 7:14

we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, powers, and the rulers of darkness. Eph. 6:12

Hbr 11:10 For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.

Hbr 11:16 But now they desire a better country, that is, an heavenly: wherefore God is not ashamed to be called their God: for he hath prepared for them a city.

Hbr 13:14 For here have we no continuing city, but we seek one to come.

The City:

Rev 21:2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.

Rev 21:10 And he carried me away in the spirit to a great and high mountain, and shewed me that great city, the holy Jerusalem, descending out of heaven from God,

I rejoice in this day...along with the cloud of witnesses.

I love the people of this country and I have been in prayer for this nation but what I hear from Father's heart is to ask for His righteous judgements to go forth so that men will learn righteousness.

This nation has sown the wind and is now reaping the whirlwind and it brings me no delight to utter those words. Many in this nation have followed blind leaders(the blind leaders of the church, the blind politicians, the blind media, the blind bankers, the blind military industrial complex, the blind judges, the blind teachers, the blind doctors, the blind agri-businesses...ect) and b/c of this herd mentality of following the blind...we are now watching many be led right off a cliff.

Unfortunately, many within christendom are intellectually lazy and do not spend time seeking out the truth for themselves but sit in the man-made church system and allow others to feed them carnal teachings of MAN.

Economic, political, religious, judicial, ect...BABYLON is falling and the new age of His KINGDOM REIGN will be ushered in...and is already ruling within those that have the understanding that the KINGDOM OF GOD IS WITHIN.
Many have already gone through the tribulation FIRES over the last several years...many have chosen to take up their crosses and be CRUCIFIED with CHRIST to self and this world system...and for all those that have been buying GOLD refined in the FIRE these are those that have no fear at all with what is now unfolding in the earth...but are at REST seated with CHRIST and IN CHRIST on His throne.

I agree with the post above about how the FIELDS are white for harvest...for the REAL GOOD NEWS.....that Jesus Christ died for ALL men....and that ALL WILL BE SAVED....we are getting ready to witness the MOST GLORIOUS OUTPOURING OF HIS SPIRIT that humanity has ever seen and I for one am ready.

Come quickly Lord!

The deliverer resides within each one of us. Someone just wrote that we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities and powers.......

We have given an authority and "power' to the politicians that are in bed with the bankers and lawyers they are the pied pipers who are controlled by 'principalities'. Does anyone not see this?

If Christ is manifested through us then the dark principalities are manifested through people too. Get it?!

Look beyond their veil and you will see what lies within some of these folks that are the 'powers that be'. And yes!
Yes! GREATER is HE that is within US then he that is within the world.

We must at some point do something in prayer or the natural to not allow the enemy to overtake our land.

Ok, here's an example: If a robber was breaking into your home right now and threatening to steal your family/children
finances, and future...what would you do?
A. Run to your closet and say a prayer because you are at peace with whatever the Lord sends your way and know that is probably 'God's will' that you are being robbed? or
B. Run the nasty rascle out?

Jesus RAN the MONEY CHANGERS OUT! With a whip, with anger and some may say violence.

Just putting in my 2 cents while it's still worth something,
Bev

never the natural

Prayer is good and from that position God will direct but never the natural.

Revelation 20:9-10 KJV
(9) And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.
(10) And the devil that deceived them was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone, where the beast and the false prophet [are], and shall be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

In these 2 passages the ones cast into the lake of fire were not the children of God, who were walking according to the scriptures. It was the beast and the false prophet, and those that worshipped the image of the beast, and also the devil.

Revelation 20:14-15 KJV
(14) And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
(15) And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire.

Revelation 21:7-8 KJV
(7) He that overcometh shall inherit all things; and I will be his God, and he shall be my son.
(8) But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.

It is very evident to me that born again, spirit filled believers, and especially the overcomers, are not even named among those who are partakers in this “lake of fire”. There is no suggestion of, nor validation to the thought that this is a place for the righteous at all.

Revelation 2:11 KJV
(11) He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.

Revelation 20:5-6 KJV
(5) But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This [is] the first resurrection.
(6) Blessed and holy [is] he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such (the blessed and Holy) the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years. Parenthesis added by me.

In my opinion to take these verses and wrest and twist them to somehow make it sound as if the overcoming seed of God, the righteous ones IN HIM, are somehow partakers of this “lake of fire”, is absolutely ludicrous. There is not a hint of this within the verses of scripture. Where this thought originated I know not, but I don’t accept it as truth, regardless of whom speaks it. I realize that I have been wrong on things in times past and for them I have repented and moved on. But, to attempt in any way to take these verses and apply them to the righteous as being in the “lake of fire” is way too far a stretch for me to accept.

Your explanation of the second death also makes no sense to me. Our first, and only appointment with death was met when we were IN CHRIST at the finished work of the cross. It is only appointed unto men ONCE to die, ….. The second death is not an appointment that I plan on keeping as my appointment with death has been met and I now live and move and have my being IN HIM. Never again to die! Now if you even hear that as referring to the natural death then you hear not what I speak of. To lay this body down is not death, it is passing from the life of limitations into the life of limitlessness. This can be attained in the Spirit as well, but, truthfully there are not many, if any, who have fully and completely experienced this realm at this time. However, it is accessible and attainable, and some will come into it.

So in closing, you say that you are enjoying your part in the “lake of fire” and invite me to come along. Once again, NO THANKS! I will continue to enjoy the Life of God I have and will continue forth in the provisions made for me by the finished work of the cross. No amount of suffering I could face personally could make me one iota more righteous than I already am. It may make me more religious and accepted by more people, but my righteousness only comes from the finished work of Christ. After all when He was crucified, I was crucified, when He died, I died, when He was buried, I was buried, when He was quickened (made alive in Spirit) then I was also quickened with him, when He was raised (out from among the dead) so was I, and when He was seated with the Father, I was also seated with Him.
1 Corinthians 1:30-31 KJV
(30) But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:
(31) That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

I glory not in my suffering(s) but I glory in the Lord.
I hope this clarifies my position and that you also will study to shew yourself approved unto God, and not unto man. I love the brethren whom you mentioned, but just because they speak something does not mean I accept it as truth. Just as you should not accept all I say as I am subject to fallibility. But, I seek to KNOW HIM who is TRUTH.

In Christ’s Love,
Ken Hill

Should you care to be enlightened to the truth of the matter I have gone to the trouble of giving you three links to a plethora of writings on the subject. Most who embrace Universal Reconciliation are familiar with these authors and their views on the Lake of Fire.

* Elwin Roach's series of message on the subject which begins with this paper entitles "The Lake of Fire Men Built." This is a wonderfully anointed series.
http://www.godfire.net/beginning_of_the_end11.html

* The highly respected, J Preston Eby's writing on the Lake of Fire and the 2nd death
http://www.kingdombiblestudies.org/savior/SOW7.htm

* Here is the first paper of L Ray Smith's exhaustive writings on the Lake of Fire. These are well known
http://bible-truths.com/lake1.html

God bless

The sacrificial system continues and is working within the lives of God's sons. We are God's sacrifices and offerings for the church and a dieing world. We present our bodies, a sacrifice.

Rom 12:1 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

One gives sacrifice by dieing. We die daily

1 Corinthians 15:31 I protest by your rejoicing which I have in Christ Jesus our Lord, I die daily.

The only way to have Christ' Spirit living within us is to be crucified with Christ. We are crucified with Christ.

Galatians 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me

We suffer for the church. We fill up the afflictions of Christ.

Colossians 1:24 Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church:

We are God's continuing offering and even the sin offering. We are as He is.

1 John 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, so are we in this world.

It is very evident to me that born again, spirit filled believers, and especially the overcomers, are not even named among those who are partakers in this “lake of fire”. There is no suggestion of, nor validation to the thought that this is a place for the righteous at all."
___________________________________

There is but one overcomer and that be Christ and yes Christ within. It is actually Christ within that guides man into the Lake of Fire. "The fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars" are part and parcel of the old man that indwells us also. These things are burned out and the Christ man is not hurt but arises out of the fire. This is the second death and it is progressive until there be not but the full stature of Christ filling the vessel we are.

The "it is finished" doctrine is an escapist doctrine bred of the same spirit which promotes the "prosperity gospel" ......... same spirit different dress.

Thou hast put all things in subjection under his feet. For in that he put all in subjection under him, he left nothing that is not put under him. But now we see not yet all things put under him. But we see Jesus,
Hebrews 2:8,9(a)

For he must reign, till he hath put all enemies under his feet.
1Cr 15:25

If you contemplate by the Holy Spirit this verse in 1 Corinthians you might see that the "till" in that scripture is the Lake of Fire. Some see it most don't but alas it is only by His grace that such is glimpsed.

God's blessings to you

Some of us reside in God's furnace and we see the glory of Jesus.

Like the old song goes, "How ya gonna keep um down on the farm, after they've seen Pa-ree [Paris]?"

********************************

This to me is what the scripture means by saying "He gives me beauty for ashes..."

For me, over the last several years I have learned by experience what it means to be crucified with Christ to self and to this world's system. In the past I would see this crucifixion as only POSITIONALLY (and yes this is true)and what I have now come to EXPERIENCE in my own life is the REALITY of SHARING IN THE SUFFERINGS of the Lord by walking this crucifixion out in daily living.

In Christ's Love,
Ken Hill

Wow! That was truly powerful. Thank you for sharing this.
So deep and beautiful....what a wonderful Lord we have that His salvation is to the UTTERMOST...that He EVER-LIVETH to make intercession for us as our High Priest and will complete what He has begun in us.

It is truly HIS GRACE that gives us the heart to cry out 'CONSUME ME Lord'.

I was reminded of the 3 men in the fire...they went in three BOUND...body, soul, and spirit...and in the FIRE met JESUS and in this glorious place of the fire they were LOOSED from what had them bound and were able to move about freely and afterwards came out of the fire without the smell of smoke....WHAT A SAVIOUR!

The types and shadows are so glorious and what you shared above is truly beautiful....again THANK YOU.

I have enjoyed listening to your and Ken's conversation and have pondered on much of what you both have shared...good stuff.

Shalom to both of you my dear brothers,
HeavenlySpy